Monday, May 12, 2008

Siberian Tiger

Siberian TigerThe largest wild cat in the world, Siberian Tiger is also one of the most endangered. Also known as Amur Tiger, Altaic Tiger, Korean Tiger, Manchurian Tiger and North China Tiger on the basis of its geographical distribution, it is one of the most majestic and largest felines to have ever lived. Slightly taller than the average Bengal Tiger, the Amur Tiger stands nearly four feet tall. Weight is in the range of 450 to 600 pounds for males and 225 to 400 pounds for females, though significantly larger individuals in the range of 800 to 900 pounds have been recorded. Body length is between six to eight feet, excluding the meter long tail. Overall the great cat is known to grow up to thirteen feet long from tip of nose to tip of tail.

The physical makeup of the Siberian Tiger is an adaptation to its harsh habitat in the Russian Far East. The coat is thick and insulated by a layer of fat underneath on flanks and belly, in protection against the unforgiving Siberian winter. Fur grows longer and denser than the other tiger subspecies in winter months. Coat color is whiter in comparison to other tigers, possibly to aid in camouflage against the snow. Stripes are also less pronounced, particularly on limbs where they are absent on the outer surface of front legs. Coloration of skin and stripes is lighter, being golden and brown respectively. Paws are also padded with fur, to enable the big cat to tread comfortably on its snowy terrain.

Residing in the Conifer and Broadleaf forests east of the Amur River, the Siberian Tigers are solitary cats that enjoy a relatively undisturbed ecosystem devoid in large parts of human activity. Occupying huge territories of up to four thousand square miles, these Amur Tigers are often on the move, covering large distances in search of prey in their isolated wilderness. One Siberian Tiger was once recorded to cover over six hundred miles in the space of three weeks in search of food. The great cat hunts a variety of animals including moose, roe deer, sika deer, musk deer and goral, though red deer and wild boar form the bulk of its diet. Opportunistic predators, the tigers are known to take smaller prey like rabbits, hares, pikas and fish (usually salmon) at times. At times conflict occurs even with the Great Russian Brown Bear, though tiger predation upon bears in usually restricted to females, subadult and hibernating animals. On occasion the Asiatic Black Bear is hunted by the tiger. The cunning cat is known to imitate black bear sounds to attract and hunt them. Even resilient pack animals such as wolves have been nearly exterminated by the tigers. A stalk and ambush predator, the Amur Tiger despite its great power still only succeeds in ten to fifteen percent of hunting attempts. The cat prefers to creep up to ten to twenty five meters of the prey animal before rushing and pouncing upon it, moving at speeds of up to 80 km/hr in its charge. Smaller prey animals are killed by a bite on the nape of neck that breaks the vertebrae and severs the spinal cord. Larger game is brought down by a bite on front of the neck that crushes the windpipe and suffocates the prey. Needing around twenty pounds of meat daily to survive in the wild, the tiger can consume about sixty to hundred pounds in one setting. The kill is often cached, usually near a water body and the cat has been known to return to carcasses to complete its feed.

Siberian Tiger distribution

The Siberian Tiger inhabits the Boreal forests in Far Eastern Asia, residing largely in Russia but also reported in China and North Korea. Panthera Tigris Altaica, it is seen largely in the Amur-Ussuri region of Primorsky and Khabarovsky Krai. Its range has shrunk drastically in the past hundred years and is now a mere fraction of its past domain.

The tigers are known to mate at any time during the year. The receptive female advertises her presence by leaving urine and scratch markings on trees. She is in estrus typically for three to seven days during which the pair mates several times. Like all big cats, the courting individuals focus less on hunting during this time and are particularly hostile to any intruders. Up to six cubs are born after a pregnancy lasting between three to three and a half months, though three to four is the average litter size. Blind and helpless they are sheltered in a den by the ever watchful mother who seldom leaves them during the early weeks, going out only for hunting. The young open their eyes at two weeks and begin to venture outside at around three months. They are weaned off at around six months and begin to accompany their mother at her hunting trips at this age. Small prey is successfully taken down by the cubs at less than one year of age, and large prey at twice that age. They stay with their mother at up until three to five years of age after which they begin to venture and establish their territories and fend for themselves. Males generally move farther away from their realm, making them easier targets for poachers. As a result adult male tigers are outnumbered by females three to one on average. Lifespan is known to be up to twenty five years.

Amur Tigers were freely hunted in the early part of this century, bringing them to near extinction in most territories. In 1947 hunting was outlawed in the former Soviet Union. Still the tiger continued to suffer at the hands of poachers who made heavy profits by selling the body parts to Chinese traditional medicine makers, earning up to fifty thousand dollars with one tiger. The collapse of Soviet Union accompanied with the breakdown of law and order infrastructure had a particularly adverse impact on the tiger population whereby nearly sixty tigers were reputedly killed yearly by poachers in the few years following 1989. In 1992, The Siberian Tiger Project was founded. This marked the beginning of a turn around in the fate of tiger. In 1993, Chinese Government declared the use of tiger parts for medicinal purposes to be illegal. In the following years, vigilant monitoring and study resulted in the stabilization of tiger numbers in the wild. Regular patrols were undertaken to deter the poachers and individual tigers were studied to better understand the subspecies and reduce its mortality in its natural habitat. Another successful step was launching of Operation Amba in Russia that continues to protect the Siberian Tigers through collaboration of law enforcement agencies and interaction with local people. Its mission is to neutralize tiger traders and attack and eliminate poaching rings. It has been largely successful in seizing many poaching materials and saving a number of tiger cubs. As a result of these tireless efforts of forest rangers and scientists, today the population of Siberian Tigers in the wild is believed to be around five hundred individuals and this is merely the number in Russia. In fact the Siberian Tiger is the only tiger subspecies whose population is believed to be on the increase. The impressive recovery of the Siberian Tiger is often used as a model plan to save other species.

Siberian Tiger

Hundreds of Amur Tigers exist in captivity around the world. The captive bred tigers are thought to have even greater genetic diversity than their wild cousins. In general the captive breeding of Siberian Tigers has been very successful. One breeding centre in China plans to release 620 of its tigers in the wild soon.

The Siberian Tiger still needs our dedicated monitoring. Building of new roads and logging is having an adverse impact on the tiger numbers and the fragile ecosystem requires continuous surveillance to boost the number of tigers and ungulates in the woods of Siberia. The magnificent cat is still listed as Critically Endangered by International Union for the Conservation of Nature and Natural Resources.


Anonymous said...

I've digg this... nice to read your post....

Anonymous said...

The author may not know but Amur Tigers do not attack adult full grown male brown bears. All of the brown bear kills are always female & sub adult brownies. No full grown adult male brown bear has been killed by an Amur Tiger (one hibernation case in the late 1950s & early 1960s) in contrast to Brown Bears killing full adult male tigers. Brown Bears also kill female & sub adult tigers as well as other bears including Brown Bear & Asiatic Black Bear. Brown bear's Amur Tiger diet input is estimated as 1-1,5%. Brown bears emerging from hibernation will also seek out tigers in order to steal their kills (see the "crank"). Keep in mind that in the Sikhote-Alin area of the Russian Far East, where these two animals overlap, the Brown Bears there are comparable in size to bears found in Montana. The coastal brownies of Russia "Kamchatka region" are a lot larger (similar to the AK coastal brownies) & any confrontation between a coastal brownie & a Tiger would be a colossal miss match in favor of the Bear (see the TDC: Animal Face Off series). Going back to the time of the Roman arena fights, to the early Mexican/49er CA pit fights, the brown bear remains KING (no feline is a match for an adult male brownie). The undisputed land carnivore is not the tiger, lion, or even Polar Bear; it's the coastal Brown Bear.

snowforest said...

Dear Anonymous

I've always remained aloof from the subject of interspecies conflict except for an occasional mention here and there in some articles. For I believe it is not appropriate for us humans to conjecture over who would win in a supposed battle between two wild animals. Most of us live in an age where our forests are shrinking and their inhabitants vanishing owing to continual encroachment of man. Few among us have had the pleasure of witnessing the denizens of jungles and plains in their natural habitat and studying them first hand. Captive animals and barbaric staged fights are no indication of how an animal would behave and react in its natural habitat. Even the limited scientific research that gets done in the harsh and remote woodlands of Fareastern Siberia or a lot of other forests for that matter is hardly enough to yield conclusive results. For there are no randomized trials, nothing solid in terms of evidence that may be acceptable to the scientific community about the behavior and interaction of these animals.

Now the reason why I stated that the Siberian Tiger is the top predator on land is because as you may well know that Bears, like us, are omnivores. A large proportion of their diet may be constituted by meat in certain localities but still they are not designed to be the top hunting machines on earth. Cats are! Obligate carnivores, they are nature's masterwork when it comes to predation. I think even the staunchest bear supporter would agree that they are not built to be as good hunters as are tigers. That is what I meant when I stated that Siberian Tiger was the top predator on earth. It is not for me to imagine who would win between these two hugely powerful animals in a 'fight'! For each individual tiger and bear is unique in terms of its size, strength and most importantly 'courage' - the crucial factor in a confrontation if you study the accounts of great hunters and wildlife experts of past and present. Even still I doubt if the bear, the clumsier of the two animals, is actively pursuing and hunting tigers.

In any case, instead of arguing as to who would kill who in a fight between carnivores, in forums, discussion boards and youtube comments - (yep I've come across them all) - we should be raising voice about the conservation of these majestic creatures in the wild. That has always been the purpose of this blog and I hope you understand and spread the message of protection of our fauna and flora rather than engage in a heated debate on animal conflicts :)

Anonymous said...

There is no disputing that Tigers are better predators than bears. A lot of felines are better predators than bears. As a pack, wolves are better predators too. Bears are very powerful animals with a build for heavy fighting & digging/foraging not stalking & hunting. They are designed for usurping kills (a virtual living tank) & not predation. In Russia, Brown Bears will dispute a Tiger's kill (usually the larger male brownies) & in the US mountain lions are often seen as " food gravy train" for Brown Bears who often usurp their kill. This is not conjecture rather it is fact. There is Russian data in this area (I've read quite a bit of it).

There is a lot of "tiger hyperbole" literature in popular culture which paint the Tiger as nigh invincible. In many cases yes but a closer look at Russian research suggest a different story in the case of the Brown Bears of the Russian Far East (especially the larger adult male bears) where confrontation between these two animals occur. In many cases, we find the male killing the smaller female, cub, & sub adult sub group. Cases of adult male v adult male are rare but when they do happen it is usually a large male bear in the "crank period" as the aggressor.

It is true that Brown Bears are omnivores (plants constitute a large part of the bear diet) but they also eat meat so technically, even the Polar Bear falls under the carnivore umbrella. We all know large felines are carnivores. The Tiger is the top predator but some people might find it surprising that even an adult male Siberian Tiger can become prey/victim to the Brown Bear which has been the case in Russia. Although they constitute a smaller part of the Tiger diet, adult male Asiatic Black & even Sloth Bears are formidable prey (especially the larger ones) & are often avoided by Tigers. Brown Bears are larger & a lot more aggressive. In Alaska the Brown Bear is displacing the Polar Bear (see Global Warming). The male Siberian Tiger is the apex predatory/hunter but even Tiger experts agree that the larger male Brown Bear would over power it. The data confirms this point.

snowforest said...

Dear Anonymous

Please try to understand that each animal has its own place in an ecosystem and a defined role to maintain balance in nature.

The role of bears and tigers is different and thus their evolutionary physical and behavioral development falls along contrasting lines.

They are not meant to fight each other in the wild and they seldom do. To theorize and substantiate as to who would outdo who in a physical conflict is just plain ridiculous and a worthless exercise. It makes one quite similar to the curios spectators of the pit fights who also want to know the same answer (in reality or imagination).

What is required instead is a love for our natural world and its organismas, with respect and admiration for all. I hope that you don't take any offence from this and try to direct your energy towards understanding and protection of these majestic animals instead!

Anonymous said...

I abhor animal violence at every level whether it comes in the form of illegal man made Korean caged fights (see Youtube lion v black bear clip) or Pakistani or the older Hollywood films/Clyde Beaty confrontations. My interest is purely knowledge based. While reading about Brown Bears my research covered the California Grizzly & later CA pit fights. My interests in Russian Brown Bears connected me with Russian research data: V.E. Kostogloda, V. Sysoyev, Okhotoved, G. Gorokhov, Abramov, K.G, S.P. Kucherenko, N.A. Baikov, N.N. Rukovskiy, K.N. Tkachenko, Geptnera, Sludskogo, Vereshchagin, Chernyavskogo, Krechmara, etc.

Similarly, I abhor illegal poaching & illegal black market breeding of these magnificent animals while expressing concern over human encroachment & its impact to these animals in their natural habitat. The problems are many. I am hoping that modern science & education can culturally shift old held beliefs in the Asian far east which is the engine that drives much of the global black market of numerous endangered animals. To this end, the efforts of the WCS & Tiger Project are well appreciated.

Thank you snowforest for your civil replies. I often come across belligerents in a lot of forums. They are some good forums (thank heavens for language software to translate) but your heart is in the right place. I was a little bit sensitive to the Brown Bear parts in the Siberian Tiger write up. As a predator (& not the most productive one at that) bears have displayed some impressive predation abilities over such animals like the North American Bull Moose, Bison, & in the case of the Polar Bear; Bull Walrus, & Bulga whale. As a kid & even as adults speculation over inter-species conflict is natural & for people in the field such relationships are studied. I understand the need for balance & appreciation & preservation of all animals but at the same time any research should always be all encompassing but yes, the larger public attention is better served in preserving, appreciating, & coexistence will all of nature's wonders.

snowforest said...

Dear Anonymous,

Thanks for your understanding. Poaching, illegal trading, human encroachment, climate change - these are all factors that are having an adverse impact on the inhabitants of our forests. It is likely that our coming generations may only see many of these magnificent animals only in captivity.

The need is for us all to be conscious about the plight of these helpless creatures and contribute towards their welfare and protection be it through raising awareness and understanding or actual contribution/donation towards their cause. For conservation to succeed at a global level, perhaps the most significant element is elimination of human/animal conflicts and creation of a realization amongst locals that the jungles and their denizens are more an asset than a nuisance. Relocation of people with compensation, development of ecotourism industries in their localities, creation of jobs through it and education of masses are only some of the steps towards realization of a planet where man and animal can coexist in peace. If only more threads in forums are generated along these lines...

I have edited the part about Brown Bear/Amur Tiger conflict in the article. Indeed each animal is a unique creation of God and no creature is superior to the other in nature.

Thanks dear for showing a mature approach and adding to the knowledge of me and other prospective readers. May one day we all join hands in creation of a planet that is safe and hospitable for all. Take care and God Bless.

Anonymous said...

What is that? This thing about the animal-fight was gone to far. It is obvius that the "Anonymus" guy is a Bear-fan, and it is a lie that the tigers can't hunt adult male brown bears. About the names of the scientist, I can put a lot of them, but that doesn't mean that it is true that I talk with them, or that I read them. So, stop puting lies about this matter. Adult tigers hunt male adult bears to. Read Baikov (1925, its in the web), or ask to Dr. Michele and Dr. Sunquist. The bear its not invincible. And by the fact, the average size of the male bears in kamchatka are about 250 kg, and is rare to find more heavier than 400 kg. The people its obsess with the records.

Pd. Sorry for my english, I'm not a native speaker.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous is so wrong. According to Dale Michelle, the coordinator of the Russian tiger project, there is no single tiger killed by brown bear during the 13 year of conservation work. People has never found any adult tiger killed by brown bear. Some homepage like lairweb are simply wrong.

In contrast, tiger predation on brown bear including adult brown bear happens regularily. Tiger usually targets young and female, but even fullgrown adult male brown bear has been killed by tiger. It is not often but does happen some times. Brown bear is a regular prey of tiger.

Anonymous said...

Actually anonymouse in 1948 an adult male tiger named "ashwa" meaning "raging mongol" killed 12 adult male brown bears and 4 female brown bears in a russian nature preserve over an 18 months peiod.The reason "ashwa" hunted these brown bears was because there was a shortage of "ashwa's" normal prey around the area , so "ashwa" turned on the brown bears for food.The russians had no choice but to kill "ashwa" it took 7 bullets with a "kar98" rifle to take "ashwa" down in 1950 causing the brown bear massacre to stop.It is no doubt that siberian tigers are the most powerful and skillful carnivours on the planet seeing as they are the heaviest and the largest of all the felines,they can reach up to 4 metres (not including the tail) weighing up to a humungouse 900 pounds outsizing the lion "the king of the jungle" by a longshot.Also tigers are an extremely beautiful animal and should be appreciated while we still can.

Anonymous said...

kane, do you have any reliable evidence that siberian tiger killed 12 adult male brown bears ?

Anonymous said...

There's little doubt that a fully grown male Siberian Tiger will stand its ground and fight an adult male grizzly if the carcass of its prey is threatened by the latter. There have been documented cases of tigers successfully killing bears weighing over 800lbs, though the largest bears (that is, 1200-1500lb Kodiaks and Siberians) will normally not be challenged. The tiger, while powerful and agile, is ill-suited for hand-to-hand combat do to its body morphology. The damage that a grizzly's arms can deliver is considerable; any serious blow to the Tiger's head or jaw would virtually render it incapable of survival, much less killing its current assailant. Due to this fact, the two have repeatedly been documented to avoid eachother whenever possible. Black bears and smaller species are regularly killed by tigers.

Anonymous said...

There lots of hoaxes around here.
First, scientific literature don´t give cover to that Ashwa tiger killing 12 adult male brown bears and several brown bear females.
Excuse me, but that´s an absolute crap.
It simply doesn´t exist.
Also that false reference that russian brown bears don´t reach 800 pounds. John Goodrich himself told that he saw brown bears in Amur at that size, so of course, coastal brown bears from Kamchataka would clearly surpass that mark. Even in Amur there are brown bears at over 1000 pounds ( see later my reference).
I have been collecting data and indeed, many hoaxes are talked, not only by bear fans but also and specially from tiger fans.
I´ll post here some data and with SOURCES, relating that adult male brown bears are indeed, usually dominating over other bears and tigers:

Bear predation on tigers

"Brown bear of Sikhote-Alin ecology, behaviour, protection and commercialisation
I.V.Seryodkin December 2006

In this elaboration was collected all available research about brown bear ecology around Sikhote-Alin, among others:
G.F. Bromlej (1965),S.P. Kuczerenko (1972, 1983),W.K. Abramow (1975, 1979)W.E. Kostog³oda (1976, 1977, 1982), D.G. Pikunowa (1987) W.G. Judin (1993).

Diet of the tiger
Brown bear constitutes 1.4% of annual tiger food rations
In tested excrement of the tiger female bear and young bears were found only.
In none of tested excrement remains of the adult male of the brown bear were found.

In the RFE, tigers retreat from areas dominated by brown bears in the late winter as they awaken from hibernation.


Analysis of tiger victims showed that 1.4% of the diet are brown bear. Among the dead tigers found us bears were females and only Bear, but there was no adult males.»

Tiger, as an object of feeding bears. 12 known cases of brown bears kill tigers (Sysoev, 1950; Sysoev, 1960; Abramov, 1962; Rakow, 1970; Gorokhov, 1973; Kostoglod, 1981). All the tigers were eaten by bears. In such battles more likely weakened by the loss, including injured and old animals, so the brown bear activity contributes to bridging the tiger population of potentially dangerous animals to humans (Kostoglod, 1981).

Adhering to the bears traces of tigerish. Brown bears can be moved to tigerish traces of for a variety of reasons: to facilitate the movement of deep snow, with the aim of recruiting the remnants of aban-doned tiger victims, to capture the victim, as well as the prosecution of a tiger, as a potential victim.

«Steve, some Brown Bear of the province can be extremely fiersome animals and are not on the Tigers list for a prey animal.

Such a Brown Bear which decides not to flee the angry report of a Tiger warning will indeed win a fight with a Tiger of similar size.

There have been several events recorded of fights and several mauled or killed Tigers owing to savage attacks by some of these Bears which are even more concern to the human traveller or field researcher.

Very simplified, the 2 adversaries can be quite well matched in tooth and claw but the Bear always wears the Tiger out. It is a similarly powerful animal but more durable and very difficult to kill. The biggest threat to the Tiger is exhaustion. It is concerned with a suprise killing within a few seconds but is stress induced during a fight with its own kind or Bear and may die more readily from this than the wounds it directly receives.

Tigers have atendancy to shut down from rapid exhaustion more so than the wounds it may receive and here the Bear will take advantage.

Bears are very adept at applying shaking bites which can break the neck once the Tiger is overcome by exhaustion.

Female Bears make an aggresive stand to protect cubs from humans or Tigers but lack the skills and desire for a sustained attack from a Tiger and will lose a fight with a Tiger male in my opinion. This runs against the pattern where humans have the most to fear from female Brown Bear with cubs. (27 human deaths during my career).

Some male Bears can be amongst the most powerful and ferocious adversaries for any animal. I have lost friends to some of these animals and the Tiger is no match for him.

Pikunov, Dmitri G.
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In 2008, 70 years old birthday Pikunova Dmitri G. (1938), scientist, environmentalist Honored RF, Doctor of Biological Sciences, head of the Laboratory of Ecology and Animal Welfare, FEB Pacific Institute of Geography of the Russian Academy of Sciences. In 1961, after the faculty ohotovedeniya Irkutsk Agricultural Institute worked ohotovedom Vsearmeyskogo military Wildlife Society Pacific Fleet, which has the organization and conduct of sport hunting farms Primorsky Krai. In 1967, moved to the Commission for Conservation of Nature in the Far East branch of the USSR Academy of Sciences, to the post of Junior Research In 1971 DG Pikunov by competition moved to the Pacific Institute of Geography, where in 1990 a laboratory of ecology and protection of wild animals, led to the present. In 1976, DG Pikunov defended a PhD thesis grace Ph.D. on the topic «The Biology of the Amur leopard», and in 2002 awarded him the degree of Doctor of biological sciences for the protection of the dissertation on the topic «Amur tiger and Far East leopard Russia and adjacent areas: environment and protection »During the DG Pikunovym developed methods of accounting and monitoring carried out surveillance of the population of wild animals (Amur tiger, the Far Eastern leopard, belogrudogo and brown bears, wild ungulates) and their habitats in the Russian Far East and adjacent territories. They were organized and conducted census of the Far Eastern leopard (in the 1972/73 estimates., 1984/85 estimates., 1990, 1998, 2000, 2003, 2007) and the Amur tiger (in 1978/79 Messrs.., 1984/85 estimates., 1991, 1995/96 estimates., 2004/05 estimates.). Following the proposed reasonable recommendations on conservation, examined the reproductive ability of populations and prospects for the future of these unique animals in Russia and the world fauna. On his initiative, organized international expeditions with the participation of Russian, American, Chinese and Korean scientists in China (1998 and 1999, 2001.) DPRK (1999-2000), the Republic of Korea (2002). As a result, the first cross-border nature reserve «Hunchunsky» (PRC) and scheduled a series of other cross-border environmental reserves. According to the recommendations of DG Pikunova established: - nut-fishing zone in neighborhoods Peoples of that helped preserve their traditions and national culture (1971) - Federal Reserve «Barsovy», in the best habitats Far Eastern leopard (1979) - boundary reserve « Borisov plateau »(1995); - cross-border international environmental reserve (2000). He is the lead author of national strategies for preserving the Amur tiger (1996) and Far East leopard (1999) in Russia, approved by the Ministry of Natural Resources of the Russian Federation.


Pikunov D. Amur tiger (Panthera tigris altaika): present situation and perspectives for preservation of its population in the Soviet Far East.// Proceed. 5th world conference on breeding endangered species in captivity. Eds. B.L.Dresser et al. Cincinnatti Zoo and Botanikal Garden Center. 1988. P. 175-185.

"This tiger (Dale) weighed about 450 pounds.
Of the bears that we found that he killed, the biggest were adult females, which very rarely weigh over 400 pounds.
He ate the bears that he killed, so we couldnt weigh them, but I doubt any weighed more than he did.
It is true that the biggest adult male bears in this area may top 800 pounds, but we found no evidence that he or any other tiger killed bears this size.
Still, I was absolutely amazed the first time I found a brown bear killed by a tiger."

John Goodrich:

You can confirm that its his email on the web. There are NO 2 identic emails.

Grizzly and Black bear visited 24% of cougar kills in GNP and YNP and displaced cougars from their kill 10% of carcasses. Bears gained up to 113% and cougars lost 26 % of their respective daily requirements from these encounters. Bear predation and incomplete consumption of carcasses (especially salmon) provide food for a variety of scavengers.

Amur brown bear meat diet:

At the Sikhote-Alin brown bear food uses in many invertebrates (oligochaetes, molluscs, insects) and vertebrates (bone fish, amphibians, reptiles, birds, mammals) animals. Among invertebrates nutritional bear the greatest role of insects. Eat salmon is immaterial to bear on the Sikhote-Alin and more common in the diet of animals living on the eastern macroslope. Meat mammals brown bear preys willingly. Most often excretion were remnants of ungulates (6.2%): deer, roe deer, wild boar, deer, fewer preda-tors (2.1%): brown and Himalayan black bear, badger, raccoon dogs and TIGERS. Total share mammals accounted for 8.7% of the annual diet.

Tiger weight figures

Various reactions were observed in such situations in the case of bears.Ñ™ One brown bear, which was staying in an area permanently inhabited by tigers, clearly felt himself to be the complete master in that place.Ñ™ Another brown bear, once abruptly turned away from his former path upon his encounter with tiger tracks.Ñ™ But a large, apparently male, Himalayan (or Asiatic black) bear (which we observed visually), like the brown bear that has already been mentioned, clearly did not fear the presence of tigers.Ñ™ He walked along the tiger's tracks and rested in the same wild boar den as did the tiger.Ñ™ Thus, the tigers' fresh footprints do not produce a strong sense of unease in the tiger's potential prey in the majority of cases, a fact which is very important for ensuring regularly successful hunts by these predators in areas where tigers live on a permanent basis.

Well this is from Russia, a study examining mortality of Amur Tigers since the 1970's. As for male tigers 2 relate to 'fights with brown bears' - one directly & one indirectly.

In 1972 at Komissarovka Pogranichny, a male adult tiger was "killed by bear".

In 1981 at Novo-Vladimirovka, Spassky, an adult male tiger was shot dead after being provoked and attack on hunters; previously it had "been wounded by brown bear " - the" left front paw's wrist had been snapped through, joint pouch torn"
It was 168kg when weighed after death.

Tiger killed by bear:

Another case of predation was reported in Sikhote-Alin in 1960 (Abramov, 1972): in winter a big brown bear killed and eaten a medium sized male adult tiger. This predation can happen only while the bear is very hungry.»

In 1981 Kostoglod mentioned the following incident: a brown bear tracked a medium sized male tiger (or an extremely huge female according to the size of tracks) in order to kill it. After some hard time the tiger crossed the area close to humans; thanks to this trick he survived. The next tiger was not so lucky; he was caught, killed and eaten by the brown bear (Kostoglod, 1981).
August 4, 2008 Branson, MO: A 16-year-old boy named Dakoda Ramel is in the hospital after an attack at the Interactive Zoo and Aquarium( fka Predator World) in Branson West owned by Breck Wakefield. Rescue crews say a 16-year-old employee entered the tiger exhibit to take some photos for guests. Witnesses tell rescuers the teen was knocked to the ground. That's when they say two other tigers joined in, dragging the teen to the water trough. "We have two puncture wounds on the neck, one big one on the leg, a big gash on the leg. His neck is bleeding, a caller says on the 911 tape. That's the condition in which he was airlifted to Springfield, where he remains four days later in critical condition. The father of the boy, Jim Barr said, "It was holding him down by his leg and tearing his calf off, eating it right in front of him." A lot of people remember Predator World from last year, when some wolves, a fox and a bear escaped. The bear killed an adult tiger at the park. What this park is known for is its interactions with animals like sharks, tigers and alligators.

See the last board below.
The weights are data from russian scientists ( Kucherenko,Ershov)

вес, кг - This is weight.

лет - This is age.

If you want I can send translated version of that document.
It mentions also those bears that were caught with 540kgs and 450 kgs...
Krechmar even talks about a 600kgs bear ( but it´s a estimation based on foot prints).

Tiger weight shown by Dale MIquelle:

Feel free to ask for more.

PS: tiger fans and their fake data are already around here...
This is fantastic.

Unknown said...

I have a seen a video where a male Grizzly bear was going away from a Cougar(with cubs) . Cougar was attacking the male grizzly bear. And the bear ran away from the Cougar(puma). If there was a lion or a tiger then it should must attack the Cougar and kill him. Tigers are so bigger then the Cougar. So if the tiger wants then easily able to kill a brown bear(male also). But if a brown bear(male) never attack a tiger. If tiger want to fight than can fight and even one to leave fight then can leave. But if tiger want to attack then bear can't in away because bear are slower then tiger. So tiger is the KING...

Unknown said...

Tiger can easily beat a male brown bear. Because bear are less aggressive. And in a fight size is not everything. And allthough Siberian tiger are nearly similar size of a brown bear.

Anonymous said...

LOL @ the anonymous poster who pretended to be an even-handed naturalist interested in animal conservation when talking to the author but began spamming the board with fabricated and dubious source data as soon as any of his biased assertions were questioned. From the format, it's pretty clear that this supposed "factual" data is compiled and spammed on multiple locations in order to supposedly carry some sort of weight in this tiger/bear debate. The first link I cut an pasted was an illustration of a tiger cub that had been killed by a bear. I'm not sure what that was intended to prove, but it immediately discouraged me from delving any deeper into this alleged data that has been provided.

Having talked to Dr. Miquelle and others involved in his studies, I'm pretty sure I can safely say he wouldn't enjoy having his data thrown about for this absurd agenda. I can also safely say that the bald assertions on either side of this "debate", such as "tigers will not hunt adult male brown bears" and "brown bears cannot kill adult tigers" are both entirely false and any claims to the contrary are clearly agenda-based.

Regardless, if you're looking for a juvenile debate about "who would win a fight between a tiger and a brown bear," you might as well come out and say it instead of hiding under the guise of being interested in animals or supposedly providing "knowledge" on serious academic subjects.

Anonymous said...

While it's true that this debate is an expression of the base desire to "watch a good fight", it is true that the conflicts occur naturally. Bears and tigers do fight in areas where their territory overlap. Nature (we are part of nature by the way) has a tendency for a show of dominance, often by physical aggression sometimes resulting in death. The curiosity of people to see who wins may not only be juvenile, but may come from a more primordial fear and awe of these animals which predated on our ancestors (and occasionally still do us when opportunity arises) for millenia before the invention of guns.

snowforest said...

You are right. I just wish people direct their energies more on conservation of these animals, than debating on their interspecies conflict with such fervor.

Darrin said...

Certainly tigers can kill anything they can get their mouths around, but an adult brown bear is one animal a tiger would be best to leave alone. The video of the female cougar driving off the brown bear was of a subadult male brown bear. This bear wasn't familiar with cougars and was simply playing with the mountain lion...more testing the cougar. Look at what that smaller Asiatic Black bear did to that Lion in that Korean video. That bear won the fight and was documented as the winner after the bite on the lion's snout. I'll admit the cat had in slightly better blows, but the bear wore the cat out and sent it to the corner. Imagine what a Brown bear or Polar bear would have done.

Anonymous said...

Unfortunately, the Bear debater is correct (disappointgly for me)I did indeed contact Miquelle and took the trouble to follow those links......Its all true.
Its not the whole story though.
There appears to be something like 100 predation events of Brown Bear sub adults and moderate females and great research has been conducted, incl scat study. Clearly this is NOT just part of the animal fight club faternity but rather very important research in Tiger/Bear relationships, conservation and Natural History.
Its seems Tiger were killed and eaten by Brown Bear males over kill disputes, but incredibly includes bad Brown Bear which had actively stalked and killed Tiger (2 events)

Anonymous said...

The key is type in your questions in Russian. Use the google search engine. If you go to a Russian paper on say Brown Bear, you should be able to pull enough down to ask some simple questions. Set keyboard to Russian and away you go.
The difference is, you will not find the Bigcat fanatisism as you do with western boards and text but more information which is Bear fair. Its standard that Russian sites see the Bear as the king of the woods but us westeners more excited by the Amur Tiger. I.E how many sites are set up like this but Amur Brown Bear, instead of Tiger?..none!
My efforts returned 12 documented events of Brown Bear (adult males) killing and eating Tiger. Un-heard of on these type fanboy Tiger sites.
2 Bear were observed hiding in dense gorse and springing attacks, while other events were kill upsurping disputes that went badly for the Tiger.
In 1943 2 huge adults of each species fought a terrible battle but the Tiger was quickly killed and left in the river. The history of Russian mammals.
These sites are fine as long as the true story is told.

Anonymous said...

"Unfortunately, the Bear debater is correct (disappointgly for me)I did indeed contact Miquelle and took the trouble to follow those links......Its all true."

Rubbish. I know Dale and worked with him in the past, we have discussed this before on a number of occasions. His research and observations show that the tiger often gives way in a dispute over a kill. Part of the reason for this is that the tiger is a strict carnivore and can ill afford risking an injury that will impact its ability to hunt, while the omnivorous bear is able to subsist on fruit and berries for long stretches.

The idea that tigers do not or cannot hunt or kill adult males is patently false, and Dale will tell you that himself if you have occasion to discuss it with him. Certainly females would be preferred but adult males have been killed. Likewise, The vast majority of the hunting and predation that occurs between the Amur and asian brown occurs in the form of tiger predation on bears. Admittedly, this is somewhat misleading to the issue of which of the two would prevail in a fight in that tigers are simply superior hunters to bears and would be more difficult to ambush themselves, but this idea that bears are stalking and predating on tigers needs to be put to rest. The instances where the bear has prevailed are those of kill interaction where the tiger hasn't given way or where the tiger's predation has failed, not when bears have actually attempted to hunt tigers as this is extremely rare.

Anonymous said...

I really extremely doubt that you have worked with Dale Miquelle who runs the Amur Tiger project in the Russian Silkote Alin.

The facts are facts and within the research paper. I can post link to the papers if wanted.

Anonymous said...

nice info

Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...

I really extremely doubt that you have worked with Dale Miquelle who runs the Amur Tiger project in the Russian Silkote Alin.
The facts are facts and within the research paper. I can post link to the papers if wanted.

I agree with you 100%.

Anonymous said...

Even resilient pack animals such as wolves have been nearly exterminated by the tigers.

Really :)

Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...

anonymous is a twat-bears do not ever prey on tigers or see tigers as a prey animal-how warped and prejudiced are u annymous? as u have seen on here-tigers are scientifically observed to kill bears-including male bears much larger than themselves-a very huge bear of two or three times a tigers weight my kill it-get lucky or even be particularly adept at fighting tigers in self defence-and some tigers are sick,starved,injured,pregnant or very old and thus could be killed -then its not the bear thats the victor its the underlying weakness of that specific tiger.
a tiger cannot be stalked by a clumbsy ,slow,non-predatory bear-cats are virtually impossible to stalk or catch cos they are the perfect predator themselves-for a tiger to loose in afight with a grizzly it would need to be old,injured,sick,weakened by starvation or the bear would need to be at least twice the weight of the tiger-as a rule in my opinion-indivisual cats and bears will all be different but no one can deny the inherent ferocity and courage in cats-whether its tiny cougars driving off grizzlies 5 times their size or tigers attacking elephants and rhino and crocs many times their size -ive seen 2 vids of tigers killing and eating sloth bears but never seen a tiger being beaten by a sloth bear-i am sure the data and scientists and naturalists and common sense is all true-tigers kill and eat grizzlies inc male grizzlies twice their weight -to believe a truly healthy male tiger can be killed by a brown bear less than twice the weight of the tiger i would need to see the video as it isnt believable-u r a sad delusional and totally prejudiced idiot and very rude-if u look hard enough u will find any nonsense u wish to find thru google and if u deny all the data that doesnt reflect your warped prejudices then fine-but i doubt u will convince a single open minded person thru your rude pathetic ramblings-tigers eat grizzlies cos grizzlies are on the menu-tigers are true carnivores unlike grizzlies-who live mostly on grass and insects and berries and little fish and tiny mammals and sometimes they eat carrion or catch a deer -usually a baby deer or sick deer or a deer that for one reason or another cannot run away they are just big fat bullies who have none of the weapons cats pocess hence cougars drive grizzlies away very often even though grizzlies are many times their size-not just that youtube vid-ive seen many vids on tv of cougars driving off both grizzlies and black bears and im sure that guy knows dale-he sounds polite and honest and he states he knows him personally-so im as convinced he does know dale as im equally convinced u will never be convinced even by a tonne of paperwork or a thousand videos -as u r a an obnoxious and delusional weirdo-u surely are a yank or canadian as who else would share your obnoxious traits and prejudiced views -thats my guess anyway

Anonymous said...

Sorry but you are wrong and insulting.
Please turn your attention toward the new research shown on the Carnivora forum that was presented by myself and another quality researcher on that Board.
Great trouble was taken to follow up the 12 events of these Bears subduing Tigers.
The Bear in question is sub species of Black Color Grizzly, which is not not really stalking Tigers (theyre too fast for that) but engaging them in kill disputes, then enjoying the Tiger meat.
The book Russian Mammals contains pictorals and photographs of killed and Eaten Tigers.
Take a look at the research papers on the forum then.
Tigers are fine predatory animals but 300kg Bear are not deer. 400kg Bear certainly arent and possess terrible claws and good balance on 2 legs which the Tiger does not.
Russian wildlife researchers are more in fear of the Bear here than Tigers, which are secretive and keep away from man.

Anonymous said...

Further the video of the Cougar driving off a Grizzly is meaningless. Its simply the action of a Bear which is merely inquisitive of the Cats but the mother Cougar is trying to protect the life of her cub. Talk about who wants it more!
Unless the Grizzly is starving, he really isnt that interested in doing battle but notice that one clubbing hit which sends the Cougar flying across several feet. Now try to imagine the Grizzly in fear of its life and fighting for its life....see the deal!
In any event, the feature was one of Marti Soffers wildlife semi docus featuring his ranch held animals.

Anonymous said...

Agree with those comments.
Stoffer was actually questioned by Sherrifs regarding his forced animal interactions which were not natural wildlife senarios at all and where animals might not act naturally.

I checked the Carnivora forum just. Its on the last page of the Brown Bear versus Tiger pages and originally written in Russian, translated for the reader by a poster called Notorious.
Looks good and concurs with whats been written here. 27 cases of Brown Bear interactions recorded from 1943.12 cases of Adult male Brown ear killing and then consuming the Tiger. Tiger predation of Brown bear also but adult female Brown Bear and cubs.
Tiger predation of asiatic Black Bear also listed.

Anonymous said...

I’m not an expert but I’ve seen Tigers attack and kill 15 foot crocodiles with relative ease. A tiger is much faster, his claws are razor sharp and some may have 5 inch long fangs and a much stronger bite. To me a Brown bear is no different than a gigantic dog. A Brown Bear is a formidable predator, an apex predator no way. Before responding think about the muscle to weight ratio. In other words if you took a 600lbs male tiger and figured out what percentage of this animals weight is pure muscle and compared that to a 1000lbs Brown Bear the disparity would be pathetic. I think that both animals would avoid each other except for periods where game is scarce.

Anonymous said...

Massive errors with the above post.
Percentage musle mass being one, when we consider that Brown Bear are much shorter in body length for a similar given weight.
Many Brown Bear are monsterously proportioned and massed out in muscle mass, particularly at the shoulder. Viewed face on a Browny can be as much as 3.5ft wide versus about 1ft wide for the Tiger, while the Bears bone build is also larger.

Tigers do well against Crocs because they are ;ying prone, with relatively benign claws and arms but Bear have atleast the Tigers ability with its own huge arms and massive claws.

As regard Bear as a gigantic dog, dont forget to add claws and arms which can turn at the wrist.
No other carnivore can do this, while the arm bone and musculature runs the entire length, maybe 10 times thicker than any dogs leg!.

Anonymous said...

Apparently a 450lb Grizzly has fought and killed a 400lb Tiger at the Predator world sanctuary last year.
Its on the animal cruelty files on the web but the zoo wa not blamed, owing to a collapsed tree causing the entry of the Grizzly into the Cat cage.

Anonymous said...

Hmmm, seems the Grizzly was 500lb and the Tiger 400lb so some disparity but i accept a fair win for a Grizzly. (details available by mailing Vancouver animal sanctuary)
The point about dog leg being quite feeble is relevant. Upscaling a dog to "Massive" to fit Grizzly would still see the Bear as more superior because said Dig does not have the claws and manipulative abilities, not to mention 2 footed balance.
Thus Grizzly is a massive dog but with terrible claws, 2 footed balance and grappling ability.
Quite some animal really and clearly capable of defeating a Tiger on occasion.

Anonymous said...

I think a fight between the two would be a horrific video to watch. There is film shot in the late 1950’s of Russian’s hunting a tiger that was killing bears. In the film they show tiger prints (definitely a big male) with a dead disemboweled bear carcass. Was it a huge bear? No. Being a hunter myself I eyeballed the bear and it looked like a 400-500 pounder. I had a very difficult time understanding what the hell they were saying. All I ask is that you guys be logical.

1) A tiger a carnivore a bear is an omnivore.

2) A tiger is faster but more importantly quicker. Many people do not understand that quick and fast are two profoundly different physical attributes. A Siberian Brown Bear in full stride might be a ½ pace slower than a Siberian Tiger, but in a confined space (heavily wooded area) the tiger will be able to navigate around the bear due to its superior balance.

3) While I don’t dismiss a Siberian Bears 5 inch long nails, they are no match for a Tigers retractable, razor sharp nails.

4) Look at a tiger’s skull and then compare it to a bear’s skull. The tiger’s fangs are at least 1 inch longer. While both have a brutal bite the tigers skull is designed to inflict a much stronger bite.

These animals rarely encounter one another. It’s only when there is starvation that one seeks out the other. Yes, Large Siberian Brown Bear weighing an astronomical 1,200lbs have been known to bully a female tiger weighing (350-400lbs) away from a kill. It has also been recorded that large bears have killed juvenile tigers and cubs.

Anonymous said...

Brown bears have also killed large adult males.
A fight is listed in old man of the mountains about Brown Bear where a captive Grizzly fought and killed a 00lb siberian Tiger breaking its eye socket and front leg.
Grizzlies are not slow but just give the impression they are when walking conserving energy. In moments of stress or hunting they can turn explosive and have huge advantagesof being able to stand and walk on 2 legs. There bodies can be twice as thick as a 450lb Siberian Tiger,maybe 3 times while claws despite being less sharp, can still disembowel cattle animals and tear out rib cages.
Canines are shorter but still capable of wrecking spines or skulls with ease.
Tiger would simply be out strengthed.
The Bear taken in the video was detailed to be a brown bear but later turned out to be an asiatic black (see the white neck stripe) and as such prob not greater than 400lbs even for a really good one.

Anonymous said...

I do have a question. Is there any chance we could persuade the Russians to protect these animal from hunting for at least 5 years. Between hunting and poaching these animals are dwindling in numbers. I think most of us are reasonable people and know that hunting actually ensures the survival of both species but please correct me if I'm wrong, with 200 or so Siberian Tigers left in the wild and large Siberian Bears being hunted mercilessly will the Russian Government acknowledge that it may have set some restrictions on hunting and come down hard on poachers. I understand that hunting licenses for a Brown Bear can cost as much as $2500 and when you factor in a guide and lodging you might be talking about $5000 which is a major contribution to a local Russian economy. But when does it stop? I saw a documentary where this hunter clearly an American was complaining about the bear he shot only weighing 800lbs and the Russian guide via a translator said “The big bears are almost all gone due to excessive hunting”.

Raul said...

Come on, this is just LIES AND MORE LIES. This guy “anonymous”, that don’t even dare to put his name, is just quoting data with no scientific references, check this out “anonymous”:

Besides, all those 12 records of bears eating tigers, there is NOT stated if the tigers were adults, nor even if they were in good health. He doesn’t mention that the brown bears constitute up to 18.5 % of tigers diet in the Hehtsirsky Reserve, 1992-1995. Besides, in the “Amur tiger Monograph” (Chapter 19) is stated that the bears ONLY compete with the female tigers, NOT the males, and they prefer when the tigress had cubs, so these “mighty” bears are just COWARDS!!! Dr. Dale Miquelle say: “None of our radiocollared tigers have been killed by tigers” and about the other article “is based on reports by a wide range of people, and is MUCH LESS RELIABLE”. So, no tiger has been killed by bears according with scientific records, the hunting ones are inaccurate and thus UNRELIABLE. Check it:

About the weight of the bears in the Amur region, the maximum recorded was a male of 321 kg, ACCTUALY WEIGHED, estimations are USELESS. The females average 189 kg, with a maximum of 280 kg; the males average 264 kg (Kucherenko, 2003). So, where are the “giant” brownies haaaaa? Even the moose or the red deer weight more than this. Tigers, lions and even pumas can outmatch the bears, as matter of fact, it is possible that the presence of the lion prides in Africa stopped the advance of the bears.

Anonymous said...

I'm probably the only one that isn't stating a fact.It is so sad that they are so endangered,I don't get how people can't see they are a piece of the ecosystem.I get that the people have strong ways but I wish they could be open minded.

Anonymous said...

lions are way better!

Anonymous said...

I think thats the point though, these moderately sized woodland Bear are doing quite well against Tigers with fights going either way but this a relatively small subspecies of Brown Bear.
You say not greater than 300kg but this must be more worrying for the Tiger fan when comparing species to species.
given the species can go all the way upto 700kg for certain subspecies (Kodiaks and Kam)one might conclude no chance for a Tiger.

Raul said...

Moderate size??? For the contrary, these are among the largest brown bears in record. Check this out:
There are many weights and measurements in the literature, however very very few are truly reliable. For example, even the most professional hunters accept that the suppose records of bears over 1200 or 1500 lb area highly questionable and are probably just myths (Russ, 2004; Etling, 2003). Many weights in the old literature are just estimations. If we going just to the scientific sources with male bears ACTUALLY weighed, we get this maximum figures:

Kodiak Island: 611 kg.
Alaska (Coastal Alaska Peninsula): 442 kg.
Yellowstone NP: 500 kg. (Exceptional male).
Jasper NP, Alberta: 356 kg.
Yellowstone NP (Blanchard study): 325 kg. (Gorged with “dump”)
*Source: Blanchard, 1980.
These are some of the very few, reliably weighed, brown bears in America that had surpassed the 300 kg, while just two populations of brown bears in North America had reached the 300 kg in the average; all the others are much lower. Check this:

So, with 264 kg, the Amur bears are the forth heaviest population of Brown bears in the world, slightly lower than Nelchina. This is the reality against the myths posted by the bear-fans in the web.

Now let’s see the heaviest male brown bears of Eurasia:
Slovakia, Europe: 328 kg. (Swenson et al., 2007)
Ussuri-Amur: 321 kg. (Kucherenko, 2003)
Kamchatka: 250 kg. (Kistchinski, in litt.)
Tibetan plateau: 109 kg. (Schaller, 1998)

So, the whole point is that there is NO evidence that the Amur brown bears dominate the Amur tigers, for the contrary, the tigers dominate over them. This is the data that show the Siberian Tiger Monograph. The few records of Brown bears dominating tigers had been from males over tigress with cubs, what cowards!!!

About sizes, don’t forget that the mighty Bengal tiger, the largest cat in the world in these days, normally hunt wild buffaloes and gaurs, that are powerful and heavier than brown bears, this with out mention the several Indian rhinos hunted by tigers in Kaziranga!!!

Mmmmmmm, I don’t see were are the mighty brown bears, cats are the best killers in the mammals world!!!

Anonymous said...

Fact remains, Buffaloe dont get claws, predatory killer instincts or kiling bites.
Boards dont hit back!!!!

Also fact remains,largest Yelowstone Grizzly 1120lbs, Largest Kodiak 1650 lb
Largest Kam current record 1290lb but probably larger. Largest ABC Island Bear 1050lb and largest from Amur forest reputed to be 705lb
Also dnt assume anything from these weights.
The Bear which killed Tiger may have been no better than 500lb, or the Bear taken by Tigers also not recorded, they could just as easily be 300lb animals.
Fact remains....period....Brown Bear can be a much larger more powerful foe

Anonymous said...

Tigers are efficient only when bringing down huge prey like buffallo or gaur by attcking from behind not in front because they know that they won't have any chance at all if they attack this animal face to face and so they hamstring this animals from behind

On the other hand, the bison is the largest animal in the Western Hemisphere. It has no predators except for grizzly bears. Unlike, tigers or lions, grizzlies hunt bisons by attacking them face to face not from behind trying to reach the nape to bite the animal in order to kill it.

Yes, tigers have an inch longer canine teeth than bears but the fighting force of the bear is three more powerful than that of the tiger. In oter words, when a tiger bites it could damage only the flesh but when a bear bites it damages not only the flesh but the bones too.

Just imagine if a tiger can afford to bring down a bison face to face or a bear with a gaur or asiatic buffalo? LOL, I would go for the latter.

Tigers like all cats are cowards once their prey hurts them they run away unlike bears that when they get hurt by their opponents or by their preys, they became more determined to bring them down.

Have you seen the videos wherein a tiger attacks gaur and when the latter hit the tiger let's say in side with its hoof not whith horn. the tiger gives up. If a bear was the one who attack the gaur, and experiences the same fate, it would become more challenged to kill it.

Anonymous said...

As a Tiger fan you will never ever get away from a plain and simple fundemental fact.
Brown Bear can be larger more powerful animals.
Its a scientific fact that some Bear can be 3 times the width of a Tiger, with huge legs and paws which can atleast half again as thick in breadth if not double.
People keep on banging the drum for Tiger canine size but conveniently forget some Brown Bear paws hit 10 inches wide, almost doube that of a bigcat and claws somethimes 6 inches in length.
Its a complete non starter that Tigers can be lead of this species, even if they can handle small to moderate Bear.

Anonymous said...

Might agree. Theres a pic of a Brown Bear trophy on the web with a Bear that is reported to have 30cm wide paws. Dude is holding the paw which appears as wide as his chest. Claws look absolutely massive. One site suggests claw record at 9 inches long which mutes any Bigcat all time muchless a Tiger.
Tiger may well have the larger canines but the claw argument is well and truly won by the Bear.
Theres some footage on Youtube of another Giant Grizzly walking past a hut with people inside.
Looks like 2 Tigers in size!

Raul said...

Facts remain??? What are you talking about “Anonymous”???

Check all your posts, there is NO ONE scientific reliable evidence, just hearsays and web-myths of the pathetic bear-fans.

Buffaloes do have killer instincts; we are not talking of almost-tame American bisons, but wild giant Asiatic buffaloes, big difference. Besides, you are quoting just maximum sizes (many of them not even verified), but you simple forget that the average size is the real one in a match, and there are only two population of bears over 300 kg, ALL the others are very low than that. Check it ignorant:
So, you were saying???

Show me one VERIFIED case of a grizzly killing full grow adult bison??? All those cases are from juveniles or even calves. Show REAL EVIDENCE, not hearsays!!! For the other side, I have several pictures of bull bison attacking grizzlies, and the grizzlies just run away. Mmmmm, were is the “mighty” grizzly here??? Bear run too, they are not stupid.

“Its a scientific fact that some Bear can be 3 times the width of a Tiger, with huge legs and paws which can atleast half again as thick in breadth if not double.”
This is very funny. There is only one picture in the web of a surely giant bear, but all the great majority of bears had the same chest girth that the lions, not to say the largest tigers. Check real scientific studies and you will see. All you, the bear fans, just use hearsays, nothing more. That’s why your statements are USELESS.

The claws and bite of the bears are useless in a fight with a cat, after all, there are several records of tiger and lions killing full grow adult bears, brown and polars. The cats are more agile and aggressive; after all, they are truly carnivores.

Finally, it is funny that you most post several times, trying to prove that there are many people supporting bears, but the REAL SCIENTIFIC evidence show that even the largest bears are dominated by the large cats, tigers, lions and cougars are to much for the bears.

Family Tree said...

Thanks for sharing all these information, really appreciate it!

Anonymous said...


Anonymous said...

That's stupid

Anonymous said...

You're talking about this video Well, it's just a clip from a movie wherein both the grizzly and the puma are actors. The bear was trained to be submissive to make it appear that the mother puma is a heroine in defending its cub.

Now, try seeing this video in which a black bear takes a puma's territory.

There is a video made by Discovery where a puma kill was take by a black bear. The latter could do nothing but to paly submissive.

Adult bears are generally immune from predatory attacks from anything other than tigers or another bear. Some bears emerging from hibernation will seek out tigers in order to steal their kills. However, in the Russian Far East brown bears, along with smaller Asiatic black bears constitute 5–8% of the diet of Siberian tigers. In particular, the brown bear's input is estimated to be 1–1.5%. Tiger attacks on bears tend to occur when ungulate populations decrease, and occur mostly in the late autumn/early spring. Large adult bears are generally immune to tiger attacks in summer, but have been killed in their dens in winter..There are also records of bears killing tigers, including fully grown adult males and tigers whose sex and age were not specified, either in self defense, or in disputes over kills or for CONSUMPTION.

So there goes your belief that the tiger always own the bear.

Yes tiger could own the bear but it has to be young, sick, old, or just awaken from hibernation.

Anonymous said...

There is a video made by Discovery where a puma kill was take by a black bear. The former could do nothing but to play submissive.

Anonymous said...

Man killed by a tiger but the latter was killed by a bear.

The tiger was no match. I think its killer was the smaller black bear.,4504578

Anonymous said...

St. Petersburg Times Dec. 13, 1942


Fort Lauderdale-(AP)-

Wallace Ayers, 25, an animal keeper at Clyde Betty's Zoo and lion farm, was killed late Friday by the claws and teeth of a tiger, which in turn was killed by a BLACK BEAR.

Albert Fleet, head keeper, said Ayers was attacked when he turned the corner of a tent and came suddenly upon the tiger lying in his path. He was clawed and bitten and died before reaching the hospital.

Fleet and others drove the tiger off. the infuriated animal jumped in =to the cage housing a bear, which immediately enraged him in the battle. The bear won quickly.

The incident occurred late in the day, shortly after feeding time. The tiger was out of his cage but in an exercise area surrounded by a moat that protects the public from the uncaged beasts.

The keeper probably excited the tiger by coming upon hi, suddenly, officials of the animal farm believed.,4504578

Imagine a black bear a smaller species killed the so called top most predator of all time.

In this video video taken from a Walt Disney movie of a fight between an adult male lion and an adult black. The bear fought fiercely even though the lion was larger. In real fight, the lion would have been badly mauled by the this bear. An angry and injured bear is unstoppable and becomes angrier therefore it would cause it to attack more its opponent whereas tigers, lions and other cats would run once they receive a single blow from let's say from the bear.

You know I had a cat who was good in catching large rats almost his size. But one day when he was after a rat, he was unaware that it was so aggressive that it managed to defend itself by biting my cat on both paws. My cat fled with paws bleeding. As a consequence, he no longer caught rats after that incident. It was a big trauma for him.

Anonymous said...

The size of the puma in relation to black bear is the same as that of the tiger to the Amur brown bear.

Now just imagine if the black bear is a brown bear and the puma is a tiger in this video

The tiger would run away once the bear delivers its deadly blows that would not cause bleeding but hemorrhage.

Anonymous said...

Most of this is all hyperthetical.
What you need to read is the Peer reviewed documentation (peer reviewed means reviewed by fellow scientists for its worth)
Within this type of documentation we have 27 events.
Within these 27 events we have 12 Tigers incl. Adults killed, with 2 eaten and almost twice as many Bear but youngsters, females and other species of Bear.
One known event of Male adult brwn bear taken but Shatun. Shatun means malnuritied Bear within the Russian translator.

Conclusion. Tigers seem to be avoiding the bigger male Brown Bear and perhaps the mention of them as Brown Bear killers means the female, old or sick animals. While it seems some Brown Bear can kill Tigers, or drive them off kills.
Which leads one of interlect to suppose that the Brown Bear edges the argument if only for the adult male.

Anonymous said...

I would tend to agree but only after taking some considerable trouble to track this type information. General kid site info simply suggests Tigers hunt Bears which is probably as unfair as Tigers kill Elephants.
Yes Tiger can kill Elephants but usually smaller sick or female specimens.
A full grown Male Elephant is always going to own a Tiger but this gets lost in the generalization of text on kiddies sites..
The predator world animal sanctuary fight does seem quite enlightening,with the Bear really beating up the 400lb male Tiger, which was apparently in good health.

Raul said...

Wikipedia and ONE unconfirmed reports of “1942” are ALL your evidence??? Ja ja ja ja ja ja!!! Come on, I think that you were talking seriously. I ask for SCIENTIFIC evidence, real records from reliable people, not these pathetic web-made pages.

And about the pumas, do you know the sex and the age of them? I have seen female pumas scarring huge brown bears in Discovery too, so you were saying? Besides, the youtube videos are NOT real evidence, as many of you, web-freaks, pass the entire day editing and putting false videos. Ja ja ja, your words are just crap “Anonymous”. Even the case of the tiger “killed”, there is ANY reference of his size, age, sex, etc, etc, etc??? Mmmm, if this is reliable for you, then you had already lost.

Anonymous say: “Yes tiger could own the bear but it has to be young, sick, old, or just awaken from hibernation.”
Sadly for you, that’s not the case, as the REAL SCIENTIFIC sources, not “kiddies sites” like you say, state that tigers dominate bear mostly of the time. Do you understand this or I most make a draw for you???

Anonymous say: “There are also records of bears killing tigers, including fully grown adult males and tigers whose sex and age were not specified, either in self defense, or in disputes over kills or for CONSUMPTION.”
That’s really funny, I had put the REAL evidence, with the personal confirmation of Dr Miquelle that there is NO verified record of bears eating tigers, but you simple ignore it. That’s the difference between educated people like me, and ignorants like you that only believe in hearsays.

Finally, there are REAL records of tigers killing full grow adult rhinos, and even a female elephant, do you think that a slow, stupid and heavy bear could kill them???

Sorry for you “Anonymous”, but the cats are in the top of the food chain in the REAL world!!!

Anonymous said...

Try a visit to the site on Yuku. Tiger versus Bear for the real deep research, research books and docu.
Big Bear do own, even if Tiger do take smaller Bear but Tiger has its limitations.

Raul said...

So, at the end I most search the data? That’s means that you don’t have it, or not?

By the way, the AVA forum is the place were you referring? Come on, I post there to, and there is the same history, the bear-fans use ONLY hearsays, not “deep” investigation.

Yes, it is obvious that tigers dominate bears, and don’t kill only small ones like the bear-fans try to show.

For the contrary “Anonymous”, the “mighty” bears had they limitations.

Anonymous said...

Tigers like the rest of the cats are like spiders.

Tigers kill their prey or opponent by ambush from behind just like spiders who kill prey who are unaware like mantis or uses web to overpower their prey.

Anonymous said...

Whether you like it or not, you tend to avoid proven information below taken from a news way back in mid 20th century.

Wallace Ayers, 25, an animal keeper at Clyde Betty's Zoo and lion farm, was killed late Friday by the claws and teeth of a tiger, which in turn was killed by a BLACK BEAR.

Albert Fleet, head keeper, said Ayers was attacked when he turned the corner of a tent and came suddenly upon the tiger lying in his path. He was clawed and bitten and died before reaching the hospital.

Fleet and others drove the tiger off. the infuriated animal jumped into the cage housing a bear, which immediately engaged him in the battle. The bear won quickly.,4504578

Raul said...
"And about the pumas, do you know the sex and the age of them? I have seen female pumas scarring huge brown bears in Discovery too, so you were saying? Besides, the youtube videos are NOT real evidence, as many of you, web-freaks, pass the entire day editing and putting false videos. Ja ja ja, your words are just crap “Anonymous”. Even the case of the tiger “killed”, there is ANY reference of his size, age, sex, etc, etc, etc??? Mmmm, if this is reliable for you, then you had already lost."

And about the pumas, do you know the sex and the age of them? I have seen female pumas scarring huge brown bears in Discovery too, so you were saying? Besides, the youtube videos are NOT real evidence, as many of you, web-freaks, pass the entire day editing and putting false videos. Ja ja ja, your words are just crap “Anonymous”. Even the case of the tiger “killed”, there is ANY reference of his size, age, sex, etc, etc, etc??? Mmmm, if this is reliable for you, then you had already lost.
February 14, 2010 1:18 PM

Is this video edited? Goodness, are you blind? it's obvious in this video that the puma ran away from the fight when it was hit on the face by a swipe from black bear's paw therefore its territory was taken by the bear.

Your videos are the ones that are crap and your posts that an adult rhino or elephant killed by a tiger that's too much. There's is no such record. Yours are just a product of imagination generated by a kid.

Show me a video of a puma overpowered a black bear like a record wherein a black bear killed a tiger.

Sorry, but tigers could only bat bears when they're on a hibernation, young, or sick.

There was an incident that a full male tiger harassing a mother bear to distract it's attention and when it did, it took one of the cubs.

Sorry, if a tiger could not beat a black bear i face to face combat, how can it face a brown bears who belong to grizzly species. Grizzlies have been known to prey on black bears.

Grizzlies have been to known to kill adult male bison by using bear hug and biting the nape to kill it while tiger attacks cow buffalos or gaurs from behind using the hamstring technique because they know they won't have a chance in a face to face encounter. Tigers can only engage the cows of those two species face to face if it's juvenile.

Anonymous said...

I know a case where a year of crop failure pine nuts, acorns and berries in the Sikhote-Alin Nature Reserve on the River tuna brown bears killed and ate a tiger. Following the remaining skull of the tiger, I determined that the bear was very large, and a young tiger, about four years. The trampled snow, predators, broken trunks of fir (each of which is almost in the arm thick), blood and bits of wool can be concluded that the struggle was fierce and prolonged.

Translated from Russian

Anonymous said...

It's true that there was record where a female rhino was killed by a tiger.

Female Rhino Killed by Tiger in Kaziranga

Golaghat (Assam), Jan 2 (PTI) A female rhino was mauled to death by a tiger at Kaziranga National Park in Assam today, forest officials said.

The ageing rhino was attacked by the big cat near the Bagori range of the world heritage site, they said.
Though Five veterinary doctors rushed to treat the herbivore, but it succumbed to injuries because of low resistance power due to its old age, the officials said.

News items on this page are from external sources and the International Rhino Foundation cannot be held responsible for the authenticity of their content, nor for the continuing presence of original links.

Raul, next time when you post information, make sure it's not as silly as this one.

Anonymous said...

Himalayan bear on the form of small scale (90-180 kg, for comparison - Kamchatka bear weighs up to 700 kg), squat, so very brave Indians sometimes try to drive him away from his plantation with sticks, which leads to death. Whatever sweet did not fit that beast, it is is very strong and can kill even a tiger. Its strong claws adapted for climbing trees (it even spends the winter in a hollow), and one swipe, the bear's paw is enough to remove the scalp of a person. ( Famous Indian hunter Jim Corbett, 1875–1955) in his book leads several heartbreaking stories of the collision of people and Himalayan bears, as well as tigers and bears.

By the way, children's question: who is stronger, a tiger or a bear? — Worries many adventurers, and they even dream to a look in the nature of the battle between a bear and a tiger. It is difficult to answer because it depends on the case - where a tiger dragged from its lair after killing a large brown bear, and sometimes as a small Himalayan bear fatally killed a tiger.

Translated from Russian

Anonymous said...

Tigers will occasionally prey on black bears. With the exception of humans, tigers are the only significant predators of black bears in Manchurian-type forests. Russian hunters frequently find their carcasses with evidence of tiger predation, and their remains occur often in tiger scats. If they manage to escape a tiger, black bears will attempt to rush up trees and wait for the tiger to leave, though some tigers will pretend to leave, and wait for the bear to descend. One Manchurian tiger was reported to have lured an Asiatic black bear by imitating the species' mating call. Tigers can kill black bears weighing 60 kg. Black bears are usually safe from tiger attacks once they reach five years of age. Although black bears prefer to avoid tigers, they can be extremely tenacious when attacked: Jim Corbett observed a fight between a tiger and the largest black bear he had ever seen, which resulted in the bear managing to chase off the tiger, despite having half its nose and scalp torn off. However, black bears are less vulnerable than brown bears to tiger predation, due to their habit of living in hollows or in close set rocks, thus making them harder to pursue. At least one fatal attack on a juvenile bear has been recorded in Jigme Dorji National Park, as Bhutan's tiger populations have begun to colonise higher altitude areas. Black bears may steal tiger kills: Jim Corbett twice saw black bears carry off tiger kills when the latter was absent.

Raul said...

Man, you are still in denied?

Mmmm, sorry for you, there is not worst blind that the one that don’t want to see. Fake videos and Wikipedia, very old “news” and some random web-pages of unknown source, negation of the REAL power predation of the tigers, etc., etc.

And there are several records of rhinos killed by tigers in Kaziranga, not just that one that you post. Check this out:
*20 adult rhinos killed, and counting. So, you were saying???

You have not proved that the tiger “killed” by the black bear was adult. So what? And many of this records of tiger been overpowering tigers don’t state the age, not even the sex, so they are useless for comparison. All this reports, from unreliable hunters by the way (except from Corbett, but he even don’t mention the sex and age of that tiger), just mention “tiger”, but nothing more. So, they are useless.

“Anonymous” say:” Your videos are the ones that are crap”
When I have put videos here? I don’t even have an account in Youtube because I think is useless for me in this moment. So, don’t lie please.

By the way, writing a lie many times, don’t make it true. I have post REAL scientific evidence, real reports, but you will simple ignore them. So you are simple biased and a discussion with such a person is useless!!!

I could pass all the day owning you and discarding your fake evidence, but I will not waste my time anymore. After all, this is not even a discussion forum!!! That’s it, I am out of this nonsense, of this ignorant bear-fan “Anonymous”.

Like it or not, the tiger, and all the large felidae, rules!!!

Anonymous said...

I think you may be thinking one person is operating as multi anonymous but i also use anonymous and posted Bear pro argument some time back.
Looking at the writing style and time frames, im pretty sure we have atleast 4 people as Bear fans on here but i could be wrong but must declare that the above Bear pro post is not mine. (so 2 atleast)

As regard any animal ruling,this would be a very childish statement for even the Samba has bettered a Tiger on occasion. Buffaloes and Boars have whipped them also.
Kumar reported that Boar were all fair game for the Tiger but only when the Boar was not aware of them.
Boars, Bears, Buffaloes and a whole host of other critters can all prove very dangerous for any Tiger once there presence is made.
The Tiger is a stealth atack animal where it probably is ruler as the stealth predator.
As fighter, it probably lies just below a large dangerous Boar or Bear and probably a decent Buffaloe.
Samba are also reported to be able to wear down a Tigers attack if the element of suprize is lost but unlikely to beat one IMHO.

Anonymous said...

A good one is the book Old man of the mountains which details a Circus fight between Grunter, a 900lb Grizzly and a 600lb Tiger.
It details the closure ofthe great Dakota circus and the melee between Grunter and Blazer.
After a short scuffle,the Tiger was thrown against fencing,with a bust leg and damage to its eye socket from collision with fencing.
There is a similar event (Great Bear Almanac)between differing species,an African male Lion and a large Black Bear.Similar outcome,with the Lions shoulder badly damaged but Bear just cuts.
The Lion was put down.
Big Bears are bone busters, too heavily put together for cats.

Anonymous said...

Tigers are no match to bears.

Anonymous said...

"Mmmm, sorry for you, there is not worst blind that the one that don’t want to see. Fake videos and Wikipedia, very old “news” and some random web-pages of unknown source, negation of the REAL power predation of the tigers, etc., etc."

Is this fake video ? Your mind is.

Surely this news isn't fake either,4504578

There's no need for scientific study of tigers killed by bear because they're well documented.

As for bears killed by tigers, yes it's scientifically proven that the bears are juveniles, sick, old, malnourished and in hibernation.

Anonymous said...

Why can't you justify your claim that a tiger killed an adult Rhino?

Because the Rhino was very old and virtually unable to move.

Anonymous said...

"Tigers can kill black bears weighing 60 kg. Black bears are usually safe from tiger attacks once they reach five years of age."

“Usually the Himalayan black bear is a powerful foe for any tiger and they avoid each other, but here the bear seems to be a juvenile at 2-3 years and hence did not have the muscle and fighting abilities it gets by the time it reaches its adult age of 5 years,” said Dr Sonam Wangyel, the chief forestry officer and wildlife biologist. He said that it was likely that the two animals met accidentally.

The information above proves that tigers could only kill a bear if it is juvenile. I'm so sure that when tigers attack bears of these species, they have to sneak from behind ahile the bear is unaware and then pounce the bear which gives them the edge. But not face to face because even juveniles of these species can mangle or even kill a tiger in a face to face battle.

An adult black bear can easily kill a tiger just like in the news found in this link,4504578

I know a case where a year of crop failure pine nuts, acorns and berries in the Sikhote-Alin Nature Reserve on the River tuna brown bears killed and ate a tiger. Following the remaining skull of the tiger, I determined that the bear was very large, and a young tiger, about four years. The trampled snow, predators, broken trunks of fir (each of which is almost in the arm thick), blood and bits of wool can be concluded that the struggle was fierce and prolonged.

Translated from Russian

Another proof that tigers are favorite prey of the bears.

Anonymous said...

Yes, brown bears of Siberia ineffective hunters of ungulates like deer.

But instead they turn to tigers which are slower and easier to catch for the bears.

They eat only ungulates if it is killed by a tiger by taking them away from them with no resistance or else the bear would turn to them for dinner.

Anonymous said...

Im pretty sure the Tiger killing and eating,is coming from kill disputes and not because Tigers are slower than ungulates. Its more likely Tigers are quicker than ungulates atleast over short distance and likely to flee Bears if needed.
However, i think these killings and eatings are the result of Kill disputes and the Bear when winning getting a meal bonus.
Must say the incidence suprised me,where i would assume that predatory cats would never be prey items but it does appear true.
Mammals of the Soviet Union and the peer reviewed work mammals of Russia seem to marry with what the paper on YUKU is saying.
Tiger appears matched atleast.

Anonymous said...

Holy jeepers and imagine a really big Bear!

Anonymous said...

holy crap these things are friggen huge

Anonymous said...

I dispute the claims of the size brown bears of this region. Yes, on occasion, a large male will grow massive, but for the most part, they are 350 - 550 lbs about half the size of coastal averages as in Kamchatka.

Anonymous said...

The true fact is if matched pound for pound a tiger will win against the bear, Of course if the bear is larger it has size on its side and power. Conclusion if they are matched in size cat wins period. Its not fair if a 1000lb bear fights a 500lb tiger, Imagine if tiger grew to a natural 1200lbs, bears would be extinct. The reason why nature gave the brown bear its size advantage is so it wont be extinct from the big cats. Black bears are on the diets of tigers because of there similiar size and they can climb trees to avoid tigers and brown bears.
Yes large bears rule only beacause they are larger.

Anonymous said...

True, bears are less efficient than tigers as predators of ungulates.

But bears are far more efficient than tigers as predators of another predator.

If there are no foods available for the bear, it would turn on to tigers as source of food. It has been proven so many times. A bear who's starving would not go after to a very agile ungulate which is impossible to catch but instead would opt for a tiger which is slower and therefore easier to catch for bears.

In addition, bears live within the vicinity of tigers always monitoring their predatory activities and once a tiger made its kill, the bear would appear and take it from the tiger and the latter has no choice but to yield in because he knows he has no chance.

Tigers are essential keys to bears survival. First, by stealing their kills and when normal food is scarce, the bear sees the tiger as a source of nourishment.

Anonymous said...

Brown Bears and tigers are almost equal in size except that bears are pure muscles and heavier while tigers are more agile, therefore tigers are no match.

Anonymous said...

Tigers in this part of the world are endangered not because of human threat but because of Bear threat.

If tigers are not isolated from the bears, then there's a big possibility that tigers will get extinct due to bear predation on tigers and stealing its kill.

If bears are threatened by the tigers how come that they're not endangered in this region?

snowforest said...

This is getting a little ridiculous now. No further animal vs animal comments on this site.